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	<title>Comments on: Lying Through Their Teeth: Easy vs. Simple</title>
	<atom:link href="http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/</link>
	<description>Ask forgiveness, not permission.</description>
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		<title>By: rascunho &#187; Blog Archive &#187; links for 2008-01-18</title>
		<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/comment-page-1/#comment-483</link>
		<dc:creator>rascunho &#187; Blog Archive &#187; links for 2008-01-18</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 20:33:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/#comment-483</guid>
		<description>[...] lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple (tags: steve.vinoski.net 2008 mes0 dia18 at_tecp REST WSDL blog_post webservices) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple (tags: steve.vinoski.net 2008 mes0 dia18 at_tecp REST WSDL blog_post webservices) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Mueller</title>
		<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/comment-page-1/#comment-461</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Mueller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:20:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/#comment-461</guid>
		<description>I posted a response &lt;a href=&quot;http://pmuellr.blogspot.com/2008/01/steve-vinoski-on-schema.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.

[Steve remarks: I&#039;m including Patrick&#039;s link to his response above, but I want to note that the entire premise of his response is based on the idea that I wrote my posting about schema, which is incorrect. Patrick even titled his response &quot;steve vinoski on schema.&quot; Unfortunately for Patrick, I was not writing about schema, and the word &quot;schema&quot; does not even appear in my posting. I was writing about interface definition languages, which are not at all the same thing as schema languages. So take his response with a large grain of salt.]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted a response <a href="http://pmuellr.blogspot.com/2008/01/steve-vinoski-on-schema.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
<p>[Steve remarks: I'm including Patrick's link to his response above, but I want to note that the entire premise of his response is based on the idea that I wrote my posting about schema, which is incorrect. Patrick even titled his response "steve vinoski on schema." Unfortunately for Patrick, I was not writing about schema, and the word "schema" does not even appear in my posting. I was writing about interface definition languages, which are not at all the same thing as schema languages. So take his response with a large grain of salt.]</p>
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		<title>By: Dmitry</title>
		<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/comment-page-1/#comment-460</link>
		<dc:creator>Dmitry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jan 2008 00:47:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/#comment-460</guid>
		<description>Steve, 

I think that definition/schema/constraint languages can help to describe complex representations better. We can guess/induce structure of simple representations by looking at several examples, by &quot;browsing&quot; resources and by reading informal comments. 

But for more complicated representations I do not mind to look at schema (more formal definition). Schemas (and constraints) can also be used for efficient  validation/screening of representations.

If we have to use some static language (or framework) for designing a client of a  REST-based service  then schemas can help to build (manually or automatically) &quot;helper&quot; classes.   But  these static classes can &quot;freeze&quot; representations  and can restrict our ability to build more adaptive clients. 

Dynamic languages can build helpers &quot;on the fly&quot;, so we do not feel this &quot;freezing&quot; effect. XSLT, XQuery, XForms support flexible data representations by design so they also play well with REST-based services.

I think that in ideal situation, all components of RESTful solution (including GUI) should support dynamic/flexible data representations. In this case schemas can play positive role,  they  do not create &quot;freezing&quot; effect and do not restrict ability to adapt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve, </p>
<p>I think that definition/schema/constraint languages can help to describe complex representations better. We can guess/induce structure of simple representations by looking at several examples, by &#8220;browsing&#8221; resources and by reading informal comments. </p>
<p>But for more complicated representations I do not mind to look at schema (more formal definition). Schemas (and constraints) can also be used for efficient  validation/screening of representations.</p>
<p>If we have to use some static language (or framework) for designing a client of a  REST-based service  then schemas can help to build (manually or automatically) &#8220;helper&#8221; classes.   But  these static classes can &#8220;freeze&#8221; representations  and can restrict our ability to build more adaptive clients. </p>
<p>Dynamic languages can build helpers &#8220;on the fly&#8221;, so we do not feel this &#8220;freezing&#8221; effect. XSLT, XQuery, XForms support flexible data representations by design so they also play well with REST-based services.</p>
<p>I think that in ideal situation, all components of RESTful solution (including GUI) should support dynamic/flexible data representations. In this case schemas can play positive role,  they  do not create &#8220;freezing&#8221; effect and do not restrict ability to adapt.</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/comment-page-1/#comment-459</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jan 2008 20:50:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/#comment-459</guid>
		<description>Peter: not as far as I can tell. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter: not as far as I can tell. :-)</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Cousins</title>
		<link>http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/comment-page-1/#comment-457</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Cousins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jan 2008 20:34:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://steve.vinoski.net/blog/2008/01/14/lying-through-their-teeth-easy-vs-simple/#comment-457</guid>
		<description>Steve is this finally a clue about Verivue ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve is this finally a clue about Verivue ;-)</p>
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